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Mesh, bodies and broken clothes

One thing that I have always hated in Second Life is the insistence on the part of some clothing designers that one should really alter one's body shape in order to fit their fantastic items. Well, they do not mandate this - one always has the choice not to buy clothes, after all. There is always the option of wearing a plywood box instead.

I seem to have managed in general, but I was interested to see how the advent of Mesh might affect this - reading Vaki's post here, linked to from New World Notes, I suspected that it might not be purely positively. On a quick examination, I believe that I was correct, and that mesh clothing items are less flexible and modifiable to one's personal shape than those based on even prims and/or sculpts.

A mesh tie that doesn't quite fit

Here, for instance, is a tie. It is a nice tie, but clearly floats a little way above my chest, and this is fairly obvious in person. "Oh well," was my immediate reaction, "I will just resize it a little". Well, one can't do that. "Oh. Well, in that case, I will move it down a little on my body." One can't do that either. "Oh. Well, I will take it off then."

It seems to be extremely difficult to right-click and edit such mesh attachments in the first place, which I suppose is reasonable given that one appears not to be able to do anything with them anyway.

And this is just a small item. What happens when the item concerned is a shirt or trousers? I can answer that - the mesh is inflexible, and either one seems padded with cotton wool or one sticks out through the surfaces. This is not clothing, this is some sort of fibreglass costume.

Maybe there should be some sort of shape registry, which holds a series of approved co-ordinates that mesh clothing manufacturers can use, to make things for, say, "size 10", or "size 16", which don't fit. That works very well outside of SL after all.

By the way, I have just noticed the gap between my hair and the hat. The key point is that I can move the hat.

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Fogwoman Gray's picture
02 Sep201123:41
Fogwoman Gray (not verified)

My problem with the earliest mesh clothing in Blue Mars was the fact that it looked like you were wearing a largish shell over your body, and things like breasts and buttocks would sometimes poke through. And that was with avatars with a narrow range of modifications available.

Ordinal Malaprop's picture
02 Sep201123:45
Ordinal Malaprop

I will not show the world what I looked like with a mesh shirt on - I am not very vain, but I am a _little_ vain - but it looked like excellent protection for a hockey game.

Illya's picture
02 Sep201123:47
Illya (not verified)

Here here! Doesn't matter to me in the least as I still use Phoenix. It's quite humorous when someone in mesh attire enters a common area where the majority of residents are using viewers that have yet to support mesh.

Caliburn Susanto's picture
03 Sep201101:33
Caliburn Susanto (not verified)

What Illya said. No point in wearing them anyway, since they will just be invisible to the vast majority at this point.

Also, I discovered when trying on some mesh glasses, MeshEnabled is turned OFF by default in Viewer 3. (smirk) Easily turned on by going into DeBug and changing the MeshEnabled setting to TRUE, but one would think that should be the default in a viewer that was primarily released to be mesh enabled. Yes?

I've never understood any fanaticism (in others, not in yourself, Ordinal) against changing body parameters. Actually, I find it comical. Avatars are infinitely variable and do not have "body integrity." That's an absurd notion (and if actually believed I would suggest counseling from a qualified therapist). One must often (at the very least) change one's foot size to accomodate various footwear, or derriere size to de-bustle skirt layers. Anyone who says I WILL NOT adjust sliders under any circumstances is making themselves appear foolish.

However, the fact remains that mesh clothing with the current capabilities in SL is not wearable, and until they change the code so that the mesh attachments actually snap snugly to the avatar mesh (which, we call all agree I think, vastly needs improvement itself), then they are of no use as anything more than novelties.

Jack Abraham's picture
03 Sep201101:39
Jack Abraham (not verified)

Once again, the Laboratory snatches defeat from the jaws of victory. I know nothing about 3D meshes, but would it have been so impossible to have the mesh morph with the body?

Dale Innis's picture
05 Sep201101:48
Dale Innis (not verified)

Whyever would it not be possible to move the tie relative to your body? What wonderful advantage does this apparently rather crippling disadvantage get us?

I am waiting and expecting to like mesh as much as I like sculpties (which is to say, a bit), but it hasn't happened yet...

DilSpi's picture
09 Oct201103:41
DilSpi (not verified)

It's so unkindly and regardless behavior to take every chance to edit from sold fashion and often i buy one real nice looking piece just to see that it isn't editable at all. The sad is that i really can retrace the designtresses choice not to give the edit rights out, even if their are mostly no technical reasons.
But with so promising shinny new mesh-clothes the story really gets annoying. not being able to move the attached and rigged wonderful new booty of fabric, not to mention to scale it at least in hole some down to own avatar size.
Is it that i should grow in my so wonderful new shoes, coat or need to run to the next plastic surgeon to fill my new bikini?!?

Mesh really needs to fit to our body not reversely.
Mesh is a real wonderful and necessary new tool for SL, but surly only not ready for prime time right now. It still need some round up, as most new services, tools, whatever, not only in LLs sphere of influence, always need.
For the fitting-clothes-to-our-body problem there is this ticket SH-2374
Due LL put this on a lower undefined priority there is the idea to fund raise the development.

Lindal Kidd's picture
13 Apr201205:33
Lindal Kidd (not verified)

Mesh is a new thing, and it has its own pluses and minuses, just like sculpties.

Mesh clothing is not resizeable. This means that merchants need to provide demos, and clothing made in several sizes. Even with this, it's still necessary sometimes to modify one's shape to fit an article of Mesh clothing. Another accessory that merchants need to provide is an appropriate Alpha layer, to hide the avatar body beneath the Mesh clothing.

Finally, there is "rigged" mesh. Rigged mesh actually is deformed by the same skeletal structure that deforms your avatar, so that it appears to move with you (no more need for glitch pants, huzzah!)

I have some mesh skirts that do this, and they are the best skirts I've ever worn in SL. However, they are also the ONLY mesh item that I've found to date that I really like.